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 Triad Inversions; 
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
Hi Jaye.

Man, you're a machine, always so inspired and forging ahead.!

Given the very clear and well considered replies here, I would add two small things, that if considered in practice, are quite powerful.

1. The simple voice leading concept of sharing common tones or voice leading to the closest note in the next chord. I think starting to being aware of the movement of each note in a chord, in a simple context can keep the brain fresh and wanting to have more chord recognition.
You know 7th goes up to Tonic, third goes down, all that kinda shit.

2. We're often told to not double notes, not always, but spreading out the chord and doubling notes on Stick, creates a certain timbre that can't be achieved by other means. I happen to really like this sound, it's almost a chorus effect within any given chord.

Cheers

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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
Just a clarification: of course a triad is always 3 notes: root, 3rd and 5th. When I talk about 4 different triads I'm referring to: major, minor, augmented and diminished. And each has 3 possible inversions so, total 12 different shapes to learn. Not that much if you think about it... And Greg's right (of course), these shapes are the same on both sides, just diferent inversions. Genius!


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Sun Oct 30, 2016 7:28 pm
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
Really, really awesome replies, guys. Thanks for your input! (I hope a few more can chime in!)

Slavin' away, back to practice I go...

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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
bachdois wrote:
Just a clarification: of course a triad is always 3 notes: root, 3rd and 5th. When I talk about 4 different triads I'm referring to: major, minor, augmented and diminished. And each has 3 possible inversions so, total 12 different shapes to learn. Not that much if you think about it... And Greg's right (of course), these shapes are the same on both sides, just diferent inversions. Genius!

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Hi Rodrigo,

Just one suggestion for clarity.

As Randy (Mad Monk) pointed out there are three different shapes for each triad, root position and two inversions, not three inversions. It's confusing to say three inversions. The inversions are inversions of the root position shape.

Also, the sus4 and sus2 add9 shapes and their inversions are useful to know.

Code:

sus4
-5-------------
---------4-----
---------1-----

-1-------------
-5-------------
---------4-----

-4-------------
-1-------------
-5-------------

sus2
-5-------------
-2-------------
---------1-----

-1-------------
-5-------------
-2-------------

-2-------------
---------1-----
---------5-----

add9
-1-------------
-5-------------
-9-------------

-9-------------
---------1-----
---------5-----



Notice anything?

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Last edited by greg on Mon Oct 31, 2016 5:33 am, edited 2 times in total.

Mon Oct 31, 2016 4:06 am
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
Very interesting thread.

On my side I like to use triads in both hands to complete themselves with different notes where it's possible. My target is the upper structure to get a wider chord. If you look at this image you see for the first chord a Cmaj7 (C, E (at the octave) and B (also at the octave)) while the RH is a triad in D (D, F#, A)...The result is Cmaj9#11 (with a 13th on top). Rich chord.

The second example is always on the Cmaj7 chord but because I use the F# as a top note and a B (6th) down the D...this way I get 2 B in the general structure. That's why I put an A instead of a B with my LH. So I have Cmaj6 with my LH and a position of Bm with my RH. The global view of this is Cmaj(with the 6th and the maj7th), a 9th and a #11 at the top...great again.

To think more simple...

First chord is LH Cmaj7 RH D triad
Second chord is LH C6 RH Bm

Both of them are great and the #11th sounds beautiful...so is the 13th in the first one...lol.


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Mon Oct 31, 2016 5:31 am
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
Stickrad wrote:
Hi Jaye.

Man, you're a machine, always so inspired and forging ahead.!

Given the very clear and well considered replies here, I would add two small things, that if considered in practice, are quite powerful.

1. The simple voice leading concept of sharing common tones or voice leading to the closest note in the next chord. I think starting to being aware of the movement of each note in a chord, in a simple context can keep the brain fresh and wanting to have more chord recognition.
You know 7th goes up to Tonic, third goes down, all that kinda shit.

2. We're often told to not double notes, not always, but spreading out the chord and doubling notes on Stick, creates a certain timbre that can't be achieved by other means. I happen to really like this sound, it's almost a chorus effect within any given chord.

Cheers



Yep. Think about a C major barre chord on a guitar CGCEGC. A lot of doubling of the root and fifth, and only one 3rd. Most of the popular "grip" voicings are like this, and it's that thickness, that timbre which probably lead to the guitar being tuned EADGBE. Pretty easy to get a 6 note chord, and that 'doubling' happens all of the time...

It's interesting, take a look at Soli arrangement concepts, then look at guitar chords and it's like Soli IS guitar. Y'know, drop voicings, drop 1,2,3 etc...

I have some basic stuff achieved on the Stick, so I decided it was time to take it to the next level and explore triad inversions. I particularly like it on the bass side, it really opens up a lot of possibilities for accompaniment purposes, and since my understanding of the 5ths tuning is a lot weaker than the melody side 4ths that's a great way to get more familiar with the neck.

I practiced them this week as follows;
1) vertical chord stabs, up and down 3 str groups, all inversions.
2) horizontal chord stabs, ascending and descending, all inversions. 3str groups.
3) horizontal as Arpeggios, sequence staring on low, then middle, then high note. All inv.
4) single string, up and down each string.

It didn't take too long, and I played with a metronome - 1/4 notes at 120bpm was my objective tempo. I did all of that stuff in one key, C Major, to begin with and did all of the diatonic triads to that key. Then, I cycled through all 12 keys in 4ths. Today will be my last day of that, because I want to work on 145 "nearest" Inversion stuff. And, it will be good to let what I worked on "sink in" and see what "sticks haha

Then I will be chomping at the bit to apply it to some repertoire...

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Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:58 am
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
The coolest concept on triads and formations....

Finger an augmented triad (diagonal)
Alternately raise and lower any one of the notes.
What do you get?
Do the same with the other tones
What do you get?
Amazing chordal relationship.
Simplicity in it's outcome

Just a little food for thought

Steve A


Wed Nov 02, 2016 12:56 pm
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
Lee Vatip wrote:
The coolest concept on triads and formations....

Finger an augmented triad (diagonal)
Alternately raise and lower any one of the notes.
What do you get?
Do the same with the other tones
What do you get?
Amazing chordal relationship.
Simplicity in it's outcome

Just a little food for thought

Steve A

Why yes;

C Aug = CEG# Raising or lowering a degree gives; CEG ACE AbCEb EG#B FAbC C#EG# I think there's more, that's all I can visualize at the moment.


hahaha Awesome Thanks for sharing!! I knew Steve would post something along these lines; Pat Martino-ish ideas with a tappping mindset. The power of both diminished and augmented and their leading/following qualities... Conceptually very simple, and highly useful. Definitely part of the equation, and something I also practice.

Still, a little hard work never hurt anyone, so right now I am taking these triads to task while I have the time, and getting to know them quite thoroughly. Every angle. Micro-management? Maybe. It certainly isn't hurting anything to do it, though...

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Wed Nov 02, 2016 1:43 pm
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
To expand...all relative major and minor triads
simple, useful and effective learning tool

Steve A


Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:10 pm
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Post Re: Triad Inversions;
Lee Vatip wrote:
To expand...all relative major and minor triads
simple, useful and effective learning tool

Steve A


Lol, this thread is gonna get cerebral, but it's ok. It will only hurt a little bit haha

To expand even further; this C Augmented triad yields the relative major/minor of each of the 3 notes in said triad, Cmaj, Emaj, and Abmaj (enharmonic to G#) There are 9 more keys to be dealt with, so one needs a Daug (DF#A# = Dmaj/Bmin Gbmaj/Ebmin Bbmaj/Gmin) and a Gaug (GBD# = Gmaj/Emin Bmaj/G#min Ebmaj/Cmin) and an Faug ( FAC# Fmaj/Dmin Amaj/F#min Dbmaj/Bbmin) There are other combos, but that is what I chose...

CAug = CEG#
Raise the C = C#EG# = C#min
Lower the C = B E G# = E major

Raise the E = CFAb = Fmin
Lower the E = CEbAb = Abmaj

Raise the G# = CEA = Amin
Lower the G# = CEG = Cmaj

Rinse/Repeat with the other ones... if nothing else, it's an excellent method of taking stacked major 3rds, and turning it into something "extra" practical...

I am working towards a really comprehensive, detailed understanding of the neck. Little tricks and ideas like this help a lot. Pat Martino put out two REH videos, and they are awesome. Loaded with ideas like that...

Thanks, Steve.

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