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New stick purchase questions...
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jsb
Member
Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 9:57 am Posts: 33 Location: Missouri
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New stick purchase questions...
I am looking to order a new 12 string grand in the next few weeks. Most likely a rosewood, but they are all incredible.
My two questions for any input and advise...
Is bamboo really that much lighter, or enough that others wish they would have gotten it or a lighter wood?
Wenge is a beautiful wood, but I'm wondering if the finish makes it a smooth surface for the hands to slide? Also worried about splintering further down the road with use.
Lastly does anyone have any thought on open tuners. I have always had closed tuners on instruments. I love the looks of the open tuners but i'm concerned with exposure to dirt, grime or whatever. Any thoughts?
Any thoughts for this newbie purchaser is much appreciated.
Thanks, Jeff
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Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:32 pm |
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Sacrosanct
Contributor
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:00 pm Posts: 224 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
The wooden sticks are all fairly comparable weight-wise. The decision is largely aesthetic, unless you have serious back problems, I would go with whatever appeals to your eyes. The difference between a Railboard and a wooden stick is far more significant.
Likewise with the tuners. Open or closed, there is no difference in function or longevity.
One thing you should consider is having a strong contrast between your wood tone and inlay colour. Having a dark inlay on a dark stick can create orientation problems, especially under stage lighting.
_________________ Alan Blackwaters
The Radnecks
http://www.theradnecks.com
Last edited by Sacrosanct on Sun Jun 05, 2016 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:28 pm |
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MichNS
Multiple Donor
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:39 am Posts: 1339 Location: Northern Lower Peninsula, Michigan
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
jsb wrote:
Wenge is a beautiful wood, but I'm wondering if the finish makes it a smooth surface for the hands to slide? Also worried about splintering further down the road with use.
Thanks, Jeff
I just purchased a full Wenge NS to replace the one I had that also had a Wenge neck. Owned it for 12 years, no issues. Many Warwick basses are made of Wenge, had one myself for a couple of years as well. I used the Warwick polish, never had any issues,
_________________ Photography website:http://www.sb.smugmug.com YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/MichiganNS Vimeo:Steven Balogh Graphite Grand Stick MR NS Stick Wenge body Wenge neck Bamboo Grand Stickup
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Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:26 pm |
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earthgene
Site Donor
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 3:28 pm Posts: 4105
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
Pretty sure Sacrosanct touched on what I feel to be quite true. I can especially relate to what he said about having contrast on the fretboard (white dots or inlays against a dark wood or dark dots or inlays on a brighter wood). The difference in the weight of a Bamboo Stick and a Rosewood Stick is negligible. You will be able to possibly feel the difference between a Wood and Railboard, there is about a 10% increase in weight. You will definitely feel the difference between a 10 and a 12 string Stick. What adds weight? The pickup, a MIDI pickup and possibly something like a Lapdawg. Stickups are the lightest, PASV-4 are the heaviest, but we talking about the difference of about .10 kg. These components are the only items that will cause any disparity in the total weight, all of which will be less than a difference of 2-3%. For realz. Go with your gut. Freak out on the SE site and watch a bunch of videos of different players and the instrument that they use. Then pick one man. I can pretty much guarantee, it will be the one you were after. Never had an open gear tuner. I like the closed ones as it seems like there is less risk associated with them. Not like I am playing at the beach or anything, just closed feels safer. In any event, I am not really qualified to say
_________________ Gene Perry http://www.geneperry.com http://www.freehandsacademy.com
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Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:21 pm |
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Per Boysen
Elite Contributor
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:05 am Posts: 2268 Location: Stockholm/Sweden
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
I own both Bamboo and Wenge. In my experience, the Bamboo is a lot lighter. They do sound quite different as well and the difference tends to increase the longer they have been played. Not that any of them have a better tone than the other, they just sound differently. Also. with a light-weight instrument, as the Bamboo builds, it is important to not cheat with backing up the Stick from behind with the density of your shoulder, or your tone attack will miss out in the punchier mid-range band. Given you are attacking notes by proper hand movement, that is (see Greg's teachings).
I'm finding Wenge's surface very pleasant to touch when playing. My Bamboo needed a year to reach the patina of the level the Wenge had right out the SE manufactury. If I had to pick one, I think I'd go for the Bamboo. Using a guitar model metaphor to compare their "feel", I'd say the Bamboo acts more like a Fender Esquire while the Wenge acts more like a Les Paul. So the Bamboo feels more expressive but can also be more demanding on your playing. The Wenge is more trust-worthy, a meat-and-potato Stick that always delivers what works on a decent amp. On a top quality amp though, the Bamboo wins.
_________________ Cheers / Per Bamboo SG12, Wenge SG12, Bamboo Grand. PASV4 on all. (+ Stickup modded by Emmett 4 the PASV4 blocks). Fractal Audio AxeFx-III, 2 x RCF NX-10 SMA, Apollo Twin USB http://youtube.com/perboysen
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Sat Jun 04, 2016 11:45 am |
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earthgene
Site Donor
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 3:28 pm Posts: 4105
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
Are your instruments both 12 string 36" scale instruments using the same pickup Per?
_________________ Gene Perry http://www.geneperry.com http://www.freehandsacademy.com
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Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:13 pm |
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Per Boysen
Elite Contributor
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:05 am Posts: 2268 Location: Stockholm/Sweden
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
earthgene wrote: Are your instruments both 12 string 36" scale instruments using the same pickup Per? All my three Sticks (2 SG-12 and one Grand) use the same pickup model. I have even moved pickups around to scientifically research tone discrepancy; using every single pickup with every single Stick; to make sure I'm hearing the wood and not possible discrepancies in the electronic hardware. There are three PASV-4 as default, but also a modded Stickup to chip in for recording projects where that tone is required. My post covered just my experiences with Bamboo vs Wenge, and I assume the wood keeps its flavours no matter the scale length. And pickups is yet another chapter...
_________________ Cheers / Per Bamboo SG12, Wenge SG12, Bamboo Grand. PASV4 on all. (+ Stickup modded by Emmett 4 the PASV4 blocks). Fractal Audio AxeFx-III, 2 x RCF NX-10 SMA, Apollo Twin USB http://youtube.com/perboysen
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Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:37 pm |
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Balt-A-Sar
Artisan Contributor
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:13 pm Posts: 623
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
earthgene wrote: ...Then pick one man... ...right, earthgene... ...I've seen some Ovation guitars, ugly, bad, uncomfortable, very lousy... ...and Ovation is a world wide name... ...but you can't make this experience with a stick, either one of wood, bamboo, graphite, aluminium, they are all like champagne...
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Sat Jun 04, 2016 3:15 pm |
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jsb
Member
Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 9:57 am Posts: 33 Location: Missouri
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
Thanks for taking the time to reply to my questions. As I stated, I am pretty set on which stick I will be purchasing. But it was nice to get input from others to explore options from opinions and experiences.
Gotta say I was totally wowed by the extent of exploration you put into the differences of sound Per Boysen! Your feedback was great. I'm wondering if the differences in patina could be from the differences in finishing sticks from year to year or actually just the wood. Different products used could change through the years giving each a different feel.
Gene... I'm pretty much right with you with the "go with your gut" and what looks best to you. I think I have watched about every free hands friday vid out there by the way. They are awesome! I have done my homework for sure.
I will be getting contrasting markers. Was gonna go with the glows, but think I will be going with the white pearl recon stone against the rosewood or wenge.
And open tuners it is! Gotta do them... unique tuner for a unique instrument! Worse comes to worse they can always be replaced with closed if something were to happen. That's an easy fix.
Thanks again to everyone for the input!
Jeff
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Sun Jun 05, 2016 8:19 am |
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earthgene
Site Donor
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 3:28 pm Posts: 4105
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Re: New stick purchase questions...
Great points Per. My experience with woods having different sounds has been a little different. It's easy to say that as soon as you plug it in, it won't make a great deal of difference, but that would be too general. This discussion is more fun each time we have it lol (what is the best pickup? what is the best wood? what is the best tuning, etc.). The most important thing about a guitar is the mechanical impedance as seen by the string. The string start vibrating and the rest of the guitar sucks out energy at different rates at different frequencies. This is determined by the mechanical losses in the overall force chain: bridge, body, neck joint, neck, & saddle. The body itself is rigid and hard and so the mechanically impedance of the body is small as compared to the other contributors.While a slab of mahogany has a lower impedance than a chunk of Alder, both are small as compared to the impedance of the other parts of the mechanical chain, so the differences don't matter much. - sourceI found this bit interesting as well. Four guitars, each made with identical requirements save the wood they were made of. [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y_tyUjkkhA[/youtube] Factor in also that you you can have two identical instruments with the same pickup and hardware that will each have a unique quality, a unique compliment of overtones. This is the nature of wood, and as Per mentioned, it will change over time. It's hard to make a claim on to what extent the difference is discernible - I think the best answer would be is "it depends". There are comedic amounts of video content out there explaining it different ways, it's fun that we get to have some fun with it here on Stickist, why should the guitarists have all the fun!? We could have our own debate here about the different Railboard finishes and how these effect tone!
_________________ Gene Perry http://www.geneperry.com http://www.freehandsacademy.com
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Mon Jun 06, 2016 2:51 pm |
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