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 Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross? 
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Post Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross?
this issue came to mind lately:

why isn't the stick is built the other way around?

bass strings on melody side and vice versa.

i mean that way you basically plays the same positions but ALSO
hands will never cross and you will have more range:
more highs on Bass and more lows on Melody

your thoughts?

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Boaz Bar Levy

#7159, Grand Railboard,Plum,
RMR tuning, MIDI melody.
Manufactured Dec. 2018


#2001,10 strings Shedua, MR tuning
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https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqqNYL ... JdyVB5aBZQ


Last edited by Boaz on Tue Aug 02, 2016 5:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

Tue Aug 02, 2016 4:13 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody fliiping-will it solve hands cross?
Interesting point Boaz, I think there was one player at StickCamp " uncrossed " Maybe Andre?

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Tue Aug 02, 2016 4:29 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody fliiping-will it solve hands cross?
Boaz wrote:
this issue came to mind lately:

why isn't the stick is built the other way around?

bass strings on melody side and vice versa.

i mean that way you basically plays the same positions but ALSO
hands will never cross and you will have more range:
more highs on Bass and more lows on Melody

your thoughts?
It is a question of what the hands can do vs. where they can be.

"Crossed" hands are much more open. They can access both sets of string at once, and can move more swiftly and powerfully around the board. It's almost impossible to integrate hand movement into the playing technique with uncrossed hands, so if you want to be a "physical" player, reaching over the board with each hand is the way to go.

When playing the outside strings of the instrument you have much more support (try playing string 1 with the left hand and string 12 (or 10 if you have a 10-strin) with the right hand

Other benefits:

1. Both hands are more in your line of sight. Uncrossed hands are in different places.

2. Harmonics require both hands to play. You can keep playing a melody part and use available digits like the thumb (or right hand pinky) to ply them. Not possible with uncrossed hands..

3. More freedom of movement for the arms, since the hands are more centered on the body.

In both situations you have to be careful not to bump into adjacent string groups.

So, I would say there is only one benefit to "uncrossing", which is unfettered access to an individual string group for each hand. But since the right hand isn't very comfortable up by the nut and the left isn't very comfortable up by the pickups, this benefit is also not all it seems.

Weigh them in the balance and see if that is important to you, and if someone can suggest an additional benefit of uncrossing, that would be great to know.

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Tue Aug 02, 2016 4:39 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody fliiping-will it solve hands cross?
Bruce-looked back at the the Stick Camp pictures - it does look like Andre is playing that uncrossed way (i thought he was left handed at first-because the stick is lying on his right shoulder)

Greg - tnx for your detailed response
those are great points you brought up

have you (or any other) tried at one point playing uncrossed and got to the conclusion that the best way is the other way around ?

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Boaz Bar Levy

#7159, Grand Railboard,Plum,
RMR tuning, MIDI melody.
Manufactured Dec. 2018


#2001,10 strings Shedua, MR tuning
Stickup, Fretrails
Manufactured March 2002


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqqNYL ... JdyVB5aBZQ


Tue Aug 02, 2016 4:53 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross?
Seems talking about different persons
LG g

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Last edited by Gerald on Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:45 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross?
Pardon my stupid response, but couldn't you just 'uncross' when you need to? I was kind of messing around with it a bit and even with hands crossed I could pretty much access any note I wanted on either side....

But I think it's easier to get high notes on the bass side if my left hand is underneath/below the right. I think that the uncrossed way works pretty good to get notes from the 4th fret to the nut on the melody side if one is working with the bass side kind of in the same area...?

Unless there's another way?

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Tue Aug 02, 2016 9:20 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross?
Jayesskerr wrote:
Pardon my stupid response, but couldn't you just 'uncross' when you need to? I was kind of messing around with it a bit and even with hands crossed I could pretty much access any note I wanted on either side....

But I think it's easier to get high notes on the bass side if my left hand is underneath/below the right. I think that the uncrossed way works pretty good to get notes from the 4th fret to the nut on the melody side if one is working with the bass side kind of in the same area...?

Unless there's another way?
It's not a stupid response at all. When you need to,simply uncross. I've seen Emmett, Bob and Steve all do this with ease. I never really feel the need for it, myself.

There are some great players who play uncrossed, but their hands are totally segregated. Matias Sorof and Andremu come to mind.

The "normal" way of setting up the instrument allows for much more integration and many more possibilities.

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Tue Aug 02, 2016 10:16 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross?
off course you can uncross whenever you feel like,
but the way i'm talking about is keeping the same position playing the same chords

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Boaz Bar Levy

#7159, Grand Railboard,Plum,
RMR tuning, MIDI melody.
Manufactured Dec. 2018


#2001,10 strings Shedua, MR tuning
Stickup, Fretrails
Manufactured March 2002


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqqNYL ... JdyVB5aBZQ


Tue Aug 02, 2016 10:56 am
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Post Re: Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross?
For me, personally, uncrossed is really really hard... Different sensibility in both hands leads me to a lack of control of the sound if I'm playing with the left hand on the melody side... Plus, I totally agree with Greg: the ergonomics are perfect if I play crossed, but it gets impossibly hard to play the 1st string with the left hand. Maybe it's just different for different people but I've tried it and it doesn't feel good to me. Wich is not to say I don't use it in certain songs when I need to: I do, but as another tool, one that allows me to do something I couldn't any other way. But that's just me. If I were you i'de try it: listen to your body, it will let you know everything you need to. I always decide based on that... I definitely should write something one day, on this body/instrument relationship. I think people don't realize how important it is.
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Tue Aug 02, 2016 3:27 pm
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Post Re: Bass/Melody flipping-will it solve hands cross?
André plays the Classic Grand Stick tuning but his hands are all over the board, like Bob's, any sector of the fretboard becoming active with orchestration, counterpoint and thematic lines.

I apply an imaginary cross to the fretted playing surface. It's centered at the 9th fret along the board and between the string groups across the board. Any hand can be at any of the four sectors, including RH melody at the lowest pitched frets ("behind" the LH accompaniment), and even including LH melody at the highest pitched frets (ungainly to look at but there's a big orchestral payoff).

Then there's the basic technique and posture (the fallback position), where the LH plays the longer vibrations at the wider spaced frets and the RH plays more in the guitar range.

If you choose to relegate each hand to its nearest set of strings as you approach the board, you might as well have a double-neck tapping instrument. I did build one for a customer some years back. Two SB8s attached to a body, a 16-string Stick.


Tue Aug 02, 2016 4:36 pm
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