A beginners question, don’t shoot.

Tried multiple searches on this site but can’t find any answers.
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Instead of just watching Stick videos and reading threats on this forum I
actually now have an instrument to practice on, 10 string, MR tuning.

It’s obvious when playing two adjacent strings at a time what angle and how much of the finger “pad” needs to tap a string.

But when playing a single note is the string touched with the tip of the finger or more of the pad? (For “tip of finger” the finger is more curved and the tip is more vertical to the string.) For the “pad of finger”, the finger is a bit more straightened and tip is more horizonal .) Talk about something that’s hard to describe.

If I use the pad I am almost always “slightly touching” a string next to the one that I want to play. (I doesn’t make a sound as it doesn’t touch the metal frets.) Is this the normal way of playing? As an observer, before owning a stick, I envisioned only touching one string at a time without slight touching other adjacent strings.

If I use the tip of a finger it seems much more ackward and the sound it not as good.

Any thought or comments would be helpful.

Hi Dave,

The best tone you'll get is with the tip of the finger, striking the string just behind the fret. On the thinner strings you can actually feel backside of the fret with the leading edge of your finger.

Curve your fingers like hammers, and play with energy from your whole hand and arm, not just your fingers.

When you play two adjacent notes at the same fret, you can play them with the flat part of your fingertip or you can play them with two adjacent fingertips.

StaffTab
The choice of whether to use one or two fingers depends on the situation. One of the things I like about StaffTab is that it can convey these different approaches really clearly. You'll find several exercise in Chapter 4 of The Stick book that use different fingerings for double-stops in different situations.

Greg,

Thank you ever so much for your response.
Very clearly written and there is a lot of information within.

(In some case I was incorrect in my approach, in other cases I was not sensitive
enough to my interaction with the Stick.)

Although everything you’ve written is helpful here are the phrases that really caught my attention.


(Got it, this is really interesting.) I was close to the backside of the fret as advised in a lesson book that I’m reading, but not that close.

(Had this wrong. I was only using fingers. This is a case I’ve read the correct method, but really did not put it into practice.)

(Completely new idea to me. Thank you.)
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Thanks about heads up on Chapter four, I haven’t got there yet but I am going to take a look.
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The awareness that starts happening as you interact with a new musical
instrument is, for me, as exciting as ultimately making music.

What is so exiting and magnetic about the Stick is it’s sensitivity to anything I do.
It is a true musical instrument in all regards.

Thanks again,

Hello,

This is the perfect point to have a Skype lesson with Greg. He will start you off with good technique and you won't have to correct things so much in the future. I went to seminar with Greg very early in my Stick playing and it made a huge difference. I strongly recommend this!

-Eric

Now that you have a Stick to practice on, don't forget to "play" too. The more flesh of the finger you use, the more muted the sound. In FREE HANDS, Emmett says You can do anything except blow into it. HAVE FUN. that's an order.

Hi Dave,

Using just the fingers, especially on the right hand's typical zone of operation where the fret spacing is closer together, is a common translation of guitar concept to Stick fretboard. It's one way to play, and there are people who make great music this way. but it's not for me.

I never played guitar, so the typical up and down fingering motion, with fingers assigned to specific frets in a position was never a big part of my tapping vocabulary. Instead, energy from moving the hand along the line of the string, constantly shifting, never locking into place, is the instinct I had. I credit Emmett for this. His book Free Hands, is very much about the physical sensation of playing. Hand-movement is a very "powerful" technique, in every sense of the word, with a positive impact on tone, dynamic control, articulation, timing and hand independence.

You can't really play 3-finger melody comfortably without shifting somewhat along the string, even within a single "position".

I had the pleasure of showing two skilled 4-finger players the logic behind the approach recently and watching the light bulbs go off in their heads. Both told me they never understood why anyone would chose a 3-finger approach. Now they know. we'll see if they get into it or not....

I'll be in Phoenix and Sedona in a few short weeks. You can get a close up visual of hand positioning, techniques, and overall style at these gigs. Playing with drummer Eddie Barattini in a duo then in a trio adding guitarist Ralf Ilenberger.

EricTheGray: Thanks, I hear you. I will try to set this up with Greg.
I just feel that I know so little at this time that I might be wasting both of our time.
(It’s rather embarrassing.)
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AnDroiD: I do really thank you for the reminder. As well as the direct order

When I start classical violin I was warned about developing “bad habits” by “straying off the path too far”, by my teacher who was an extremely talented 1st chair and solo player. (Who was very very strict.)

I never have really given myself permission to just play and have fun.
(I felt that I had not earned the right.)
(I lost her as a teacher two years ago when I moved from CA to AZ.)
She though I was not serious enough or I would have never moved to AZ.

Old habits die hard. Got the Stick and I just started trying to learn all the notes on the fretboard, studying scales, map out chords, improve my sound, etc. (Not really playing for fun.)

I enjoy playing Watermark by Enya on the piano as it’s very easy AND relaxing for me.
I’m just going to start working on a version of that tomorrow on the SG12 and HAVE FUN.
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greg: Wow, again thank you. Your clarity of writing is excellent and so is your timing. For the past couple of days I have been trying trying runs of notes using both 3 fingers and 4 fingers. trying to figure out what direction to go. I just incorrectly assumed that if I did not learn 4 finger method I would be giving up something. But if I understand you correctly I gain energy due to the motion created by Hand-movement by using the 3 finger method. Which will result in a better way of playing the Stick.
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Lee Vatip: Done, I’ll be there. Watch your “hand positioning”?
I’m not sure. From the videos I’ve seen of your playing
I can only hope to see your fingers. (They move so fast.)
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I really appreciate all of your though and time on my behalf.

Oh no!!! Don't think this! I started Skype lessons with Greg several weeks ago and it's well worth it. I've been playing for less than a year on my own and made good progress. Greg's lessons however are pushing me in positive directions I would not have figured out on my own (multi instruments for years - mostly guitar, bass, etc.). A picture is worth 1000 words and a single video lesson is worth 10,000. Do yourself a favor and at least try one or two.

Now if I can just learn to keep the thumb of my right hand tucked instead of letting it stick out like I'm hitchhiking!

Karma

I can't say that 3-fingers is necessarily a "better way"; there are clearly great players, like Bob and Steve who use a 4-finger approach. Emmett's arguments for 3 fingers in Free Hands convinced me of its merits right away. I understand the arguments for 4 fingers (especially it's familiarity to guitarists), I just found 3 fingers to be fast and fluid, and nothing I've encountered since has made me rethink that conclusion.

What I can say is that by putting more energy into the string you get a better tone, and hand movement gives you a lot more energy, and helps you control that energy as well. Anyone who has been to one of my seminars in the past few years has seen (and heard) this demonstrated.

It's much easier to use hand movement with a 3-finger approach because you have to move the hand to cover some of the fret spans anyway. So it becomes instinctive. It also becomes the basis for navigating the entire board fluidly, without really thinking about positions at all.

I can also say that the #1 difficulty guitar-background players have related to me is developing hand independence. As I watched them play I realized that the connectedness of the hands was driven by two things:

1. Right hand dominance. The right hand has controlled phrasing for as long as the person has played guitar or bass, so the left hand reacts to it. This can be corrected by using hand motion for phrasing and by tapping the left foot when playing (anything but tapping the right foot, which reinforces right hand dominance).

2. Giving too much responsibility to the fingers. When relying on the fingers alone, the ability to phrase truly independently is limited. Using hand motion to define the rhythm of the phrase gives each hand the power and ability to relate to the music overall and breaks down the interconnectedness of the hands. The fingering ends up not mattering at all, and you can be much more free with your fingering choices.

Think about how many rhythm instruments work. The energy and precision of the timing comes from arm movement. We can have that precision as well, by simply adding hand movement to support the finger movement.

As long as the fingers are responsible for executing the rhythm (along with everything else), it's much harder for them not to act together, so it's much harder to develop rhythmic hand independence.

I'm currently filming a basic technique video that lays this all out. In the meantime, if you haven't already seen it, this video shows how the basic hand motion works:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVNNUHKZWLw[/youtube]

Losing the 4th finger as part of basic (right-hand) technique eliminates the need to make fingering choices based on position-oriented play. It also gets rid of the awkward transition between fingers 3 and 4, and you end up using the 3rd finger a lot more often.

But there will be times when you want to use it for sub-techniques and certain chords. If you have hand-movement as the foundation of your technique, then that little weak pinky can sound just as strong and powerful as the rest of the fingers (well, almost )

Thanks to Eric and Karma for their votes of confidence. It's hard to build a sturdy house if you have to replace the foundation. I definitely believe in early basic technique lessons, especially if you are coming from a guitar or bass background, where you may be tempted to transfer technique concepts that you'll end up having to undo later on.